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jonfan
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Rating: 0 of 0 votes Quote jonfan Replybullet Topic: Did Mohammed copy Paul?
    Posted: 08 December 2006 at 4:48pm
I have seen many post here calling Paul a false apostle and he manipulated Christianity. How then, did Mohammed get the same message?



Volume 9, Book 93, Number 589:
Narrated Abu Huraira:

the Prophet said, "Allah said, "I have prepared for My righteous slaves (such excellent things) as no eye has ever seen, nor an ear has ever heard nor a human heart can ever think of.' "

http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/fundamentals/hadithsunnah/bukhari/093.sbt.html


1 Corinthians 2:9
2:9. But, as it is written: That eye hath not seen, nor ear heard: neither hath it entered into the heart of man, what things God hath prepared for them that love him.


God bless,
Jonfan




Edited by jonfan - 08 December 2006 at 4:52pm
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laurieann
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Rating: -1 of 1 votes Quote laurieann Replybullet Posted: 08 December 2006 at 4:55pm
Lots of the Quran is bible verses.
This is why I think men compiled it from former works.
Laurie
 
Gnostic Gospels and Mohammed
quote:

THE GOSPEL OF THOMAS is the darling of New Age philosophers who refer to it at “The Fifth Gospel.” Mohammed referenced it in the Koran. Allegedly it was written by Didymos Judas Thomas which means, Judas “the twin.” The Gnostics called Thomas the twin brother of Jesus.



Edited by laurieann - 08 December 2006 at 5:00pm
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jonfan
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Rating: 0 of 0 votes Quote jonfan Replybullet Posted: 08 December 2006 at 5:00pm
Originally posted by laurieann

Lots of the Quran is bible verses.
This is why I think men compiled it from former works.

Laurie


YOu should probably back that up with some evidence.

God bless,
Jonfan
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laurieann
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Rating: -1 of 1 votes Quote laurieann Replybullet Posted: 08 December 2006 at 5:01pm
Originally posted by jonfan

Originally posted by laurieann

Lots of the Quran is bible verses.
This is why I think men compiled it from former works.

Laurie


YOu should probably back that up with some evidence.

God bless,
Jonfan
Many Islamic believers quote Quran verses which are identical to Old Testament scripture.
They have already provided the evidence.
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M.A.R.W.A.N
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Rating: 0 of 2 votes Quote M.A.R.W.A.N Replybullet Posted: 08 December 2006 at 5:02pm
Jesus pbuh, according to the Bible, claims that God created the earth. Does that mean he got his message from Moses pbuh because he said something similar first? And did Moses pbuh copy Abraham pbuh??
 
 
I think you already know the answer to your question. But muslims believe that Allah sends a message to mankind thru Messengers (like the ones I listed). If something in Islam happens to coincide with the Bible, that's fine.. The way we work the Bible is like this:
 
1- Some parts of the Bible are true, we accept them.
2- Some parts of the Bible are false, we don't accept them.
3- As for the rest, we simply don't know because Allah didn't give us that knowledge, so we don't confirm nor deny.
 
 
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laurieann
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Rating: -1 of 1 votes Quote laurieann Replybullet Posted: 08 December 2006 at 5:05pm
Jesus definitely quoted the Old Testament, no doubt about it.
 
You can read more here:

What Jesus Said
Jesus used the prophecies of the Old Testament as powerful evidences when he spoke to the apostles after he had risen from the dead. This is what he said: "These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me. Then opened he their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures" (Luke 24:44,45). Earlier, in the same chapter, we read: "And beginning at Moses and all the prophets, he expounded unto them in all the scriptures the things concerning himself" (Luke 24:27).

These are important and significant words. Jesus took the apostles back to the three constituent parts of the Old Testament - the books of Moses, the Prophets and the Psalms. He said that in those scriptures there were things about himself which were being fulfilled in his own life-story. "In all the scriptures" is how Jesus summed up the evidence. Describing some of these prophecies, Jesus said: "Moses wrote of me" (John 5:46). Moses lived about fifteen hundred years before Jesus!

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laurieann
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Rating: -1 of 1 votes Quote laurieann Replybullet Posted: 08 December 2006 at 5:06pm
Originally posted by laurieann

Lots of the Quran is bible verses.
This is why I think men compiled it from former works.
Laurie
 
Gnostic Gospels and Mohammed
quote:

THE GOSPEL OF THOMAS is the darling of New Age philosophers who refer to it at “The Fifth Gospel.” Mohammed referenced it in the Koran. Allegedly it was written by Didymos Judas Thomas which means, Judas “the twin.” The Gnostics called Thomas the twin brother of Jesus.

So, it appears the someone foisted gnostic gospels unto Mohammed, too bad he didn't know they were fake.
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laurieann
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Rating: -1 of 1 votes Quote laurieann Replybullet Posted: 08 December 2006 at 5:07pm
Gnostics are attempting to unite "monotheists" around the worship of lucifer.
Who wants unity if it means bowing to the enemy of the Creator?
 
Jesus is a much better uniter of monotheists, because He submits to God.
 
Laurie
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SoloJazz  
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Rating: 0 of 0 votes Quote SoloJazz Replybullet Posted: 08 December 2006 at 5:24pm
Originally posted by M.A.R.W.A.N

Jesus pbuh, according to the Bible, claims that God created the earth. Does that mean he got his message from Moses pbuh because he said something similar first? And did Moses pbuh copy Abraham pbuh??
 
 
I think you already know the answer to your question. But muslims believe that Allah sends a message to mankind thru Messengers (like the ones I listed). If something in Islam happens to coincide with the Bible, that's fine.. The way we work the Bible is like this:
 
1- Some parts of the Bible are true, we accept them.
2- Some parts of the Bible are false, we don't accept them.
3- As for the rest, we simply don't know because Allah didn't give us that knowledge, so we don't confirm nor deny.
 
 
 
Thankyou for such a wonderful post Marwan.
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laurieann
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Rating: -1 of 1 votes Quote laurieann Replybullet Posted: 08 December 2006 at 5:25pm
Why did Mohammed quote gnostic gospels?
Gnostics say the Creator is evil.
Laurie
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jonfan
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Rating: 0 of 0 votes Quote jonfan Replybullet Posted: 08 December 2006 at 5:28pm
Originally posted by M.A.R.W.A.N


Jesus pbuh, according to the Bible, claims that God created the earth. Does that mean he got his message from Moses pbuh because he said something similar first? And did Moses pbuh copy Abraham pbuh??

 

 

I think you already know the answer to your question. But muslims believe that Allah sends a message to mankind thru Messengers (like the ones I listed). If something in Islam happens to coincide with the Bible, that's fine.. The way we work the Bible is like this:

 

1- Some parts of the Bible are true, we accept them.

2- Some parts of the Bible are false, we don't accept them.

3- As for the rest, we simply don't know because Allah didn't give us that knowledge, so we don't confirm nor deny.

 

 


Yes MARAWAN but from my experience here Paul has been constantly accused of not being a man of God but rather a fake. So how can you say the part that Paul wrote that rings true to the Qu'ran is God's word when many Muslims here have done there best to "expose" Paul as being a fake. How do you mend the two?

God bless,
Jon

Edited by jonfan - 08 December 2006 at 5:39pm
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M.A.R.W.A.N
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Rating: 0 of 2 votes Quote M.A.R.W.A.N Replybullet Posted: 08 December 2006 at 5:47pm

I never accused Paul of being a fake, mainly because I'm not interested in those types of subjects, and I don't want to disrespect someone Christians hold dear. That's why I never talk about Paul.

I think the "exposing" parties inter-religious debators throw are mainly unproductive, no one ever benefits. I'd also add that most muslims aren't interested about Paul except maybe for learning purposes. The ones you meet who argue with you have most likely been in the inter-religious arena for so long....exposing Paul becomes part of their natural way of thinking (similar to how many Christians bring up Saudi Arabia when talking to muslims)...
 
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jonfan
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Rating: 0 of 0 votes Quote jonfan Replybullet Posted: 08 December 2006 at 5:52pm
Originally posted by M.A.R.W.A.N

I never accused Paul of being a fake, mainly because I'm not interested in those types of subjects, and I don't want to disrespect someone Christians hold dear. That's why I never talk about Paul.


I think the "exposing" parties inter-religious debators throw are mainly unproductive, no one ever benefits. I'd also add that most muslims aren't interested about Paul except maybe for learning purposes. The ones you meet who argue with you have most likely been in the inter-religious arena for so long....exposing Paul becomes part of their natural way of thinking (similar to how many Christians bring up Saudi Arabia when talking to muslims)...

 


So would you agree than that Paul was an apostle of God?

God Bless,
Jon

Edited by jonfan - 08 December 2006 at 5:53pm
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M.A.R.W.A.N
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Rating: 0 of 2 votes Quote M.A.R.W.A.N Replybullet Posted: 08 December 2006 at 6:10pm
No I wouldn't.
 
To a Catholic, being that an apostle is usually defined as:
 
1- A disciple of Jesus
2- One who carried the message of the Christianity to the world
 
...so naturally, I don't believe Paul was an apostle of God, because I don't believe in the Christian message.
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