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hamayoun  
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Rating: 0 of 0 votes Quote hamayoun Replybullet Posted: 03 April 2008 at 4:14pm
"As a black person, I think it's actually detrimental not to see how racism work and why it's still prevelent in our society."

Can't talk about the USA, but in the UK at least it's often been seen as an excuse for violence by thugs by the uneducated, just like hooliganism in soccer.  Never heard of 'Paki-bashing'?  And Wilders is nothing more than a grown up 'Paki-basher'.
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z ardy  
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Rating: 0 of 0 votes Quote z ardy Replybullet Posted: 03 April 2008 at 4:19pm

what worries me is when those who do not read al-Quran believes the message in the film. for some, they might not notice that the verses that were displayed are actually incomplete ones. being in a multiracial country with many religions... it might spark suspicion among us and that is very bad. thank God, for that, a team was recruited in my university to give explanation and debate against the messages that is trying to be conveyed in the film. it also worries me that majority of Dutch citizens support the release of the film. it must mean something...

let's all be matured and stop arguing for nothing
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hamayoun  
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Rating: 0 of 0 votes Quote hamayoun Replybullet Posted: 03 April 2008 at 4:22pm
Salam

Here is the profile of a self confessed 'paki basher'.  Don't view it if you are sensitive.  Would anyone not think that spreading a link like this around is exactly what the guy would want?  Wilders is in the same league as this guy.  If majority of dutch people support release of moive, it's because in Europe it's considerd free speech to spout racism.  Doesn't mean they agree with his sentiments.
May Allah give me patience, Ameen.

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Aviatrix  
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Rating: 0 of 0 votes Quote Aviatrix Replybullet Posted: 03 April 2008 at 4:41pm
With freedom of expression comes responsibility. Weren't we all taught that even with freedom of speech it's still wrong to shout "Fire!" in a movie theater?
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IssaRaheem  
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Rating: 0 of 0 votes Quote IssaRaheem Replybullet Posted: 03 April 2008 at 6:38pm
Salaam,
 
Whats the surprise? Bashing Islam in hopes of stirring up ridiculous protests were people lose thier lives are a big money maker.. Of course this "Film" should be debated, but not on the level this director wants it to go in his favor.. Look at Salmun Rushdie for instance, a not so very good author became a superstar (Jokingly put of course).. Ive seen alot of this, so called experts on Islam because they have a book published, or a Sundance Film Festivle style documentary... You know, Hamza Yusuf had a lecture where he mentions this type of phenomenon..
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bayleaf  
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Rating: 0 of 0 votes Quote bayleaf Replybullet Posted: 03 April 2008 at 11:57pm
Off topic, but Salman Rushdie is actually quite a brilliant author.  I'd put him on par with Irish authors James Joyce and Samuel Beckett and American author Allen Ginsberg.  Midnight's Children is one of the best novels I've ever read....
 
...but I digress....


Edited by bayleaf - 03 April 2008 at 11:58pm
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Al-Cordoby  
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Rating: 0 of 0 votes Quote Al-Cordoby Replybullet Posted: 04 April 2008 at 12:35am
Originally posted by hamayoun

Salam

Scooby, what Wilders wants more than anything else is a REACTION to his movie from the muslim world.  It's like a man who abuses his spouse verbally... he just does it to get a kick out of it, and gets his satisfaction from seeing her react.  That's why I personally don't want to give him the satisfaction of seeing me even flinch at his offence. 
 
I agree. That's exactly the point of the whole film: Provocation
 
Reminds me of bull fighting in Spain
 
The matador provokes the bull with his red flag, and each time the bull responds, he sticks a knife in the bull's back, till it dies
 
That's exactly what some Europeans want to do today with Muslims living in Europe: Provocation with books, cartoons, films ... etc so they get all upset, hoping that some of the more extreme elements among Muslims would react against the law, then they would have the right excuse for a mass inquisition against all European Muslims ...
 
Bull fighting is a good reminder of this strategy, and it's time for Muslims to wake up !
 
 
 
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Nura  
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Rating: 0 of 0 votes Quote Nura Replybullet Posted: 04 April 2008 at 1:31pm
Originally posted by bayleaf

Off topic, but Salman Rushdie is actually quite a brilliant author.  I'd put him on par with Irish authors James Joyce and Samuel Beckett and American author Allen Ginsberg.  Midnight's Children is one of the best novels I've ever read....
 
...but I digress....
 
Hi bayleaf, I've never read Allen GInsberg, but putting Salman Rushdie at the same level as James Joyce...you cannot be serious!
And notice that I'm not partial against Rushdie because of his Satanic verses, he's not that bad as a writer, but nothing to do with the authors you quotes...
Spare me the political events and power struggles, as the whole earth is my homeland and all men are my fellow countrymen. K.Gibran
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Nura  
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Rating: 0 of 0 votes Quote Nura Replybullet Posted: 04 April 2008 at 1:34pm
Originally posted by hamayoun

"As a black person, I think it's actually detrimental not to see how racism work and why it's still prevelent in our society."

Can't talk about the USA, but in the UK at least it's often been seen as an excuse for violence by thugs by the uneducated, just like hooliganism in soccer.  Never heard of 'Paki-bashing'?  And Wilders is nothing more than a grown up 'Paki-basher'.
 
Salam Hamayoun, there was a German journalist some days ago on TV who commented on the same issue. He said that 20 years ago racism against the turkish minority was mainly spread among people with low education. Now the same racism has climbed up to the upper levels of the society and just changed its name: among the intellectuals its name is now "islam criticism".
He also draw some iteresting parallels with the growing of anti-semitism in Europe in the first decades of the XX century...and I must admit I was quite scared!
Spare me the political events and power struggles, as the whole earth is my homeland and all men are my fellow countrymen. K.Gibran
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scruggnut  
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Rating: 0 of 0 votes Quote scruggnut Replybullet Posted: 04 April 2008 at 4:30pm
Muslim bashing is not racism...no matter how you wish to put it.  Since when is there a muslim race?
It's discrimination at its worst; but racism it is not.
Waiting an eternity for an apology from one who never apologizes but always demands one.
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scruggnut  
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Rating: 0 of 0 votes Quote scruggnut Replybullet Posted: 04 April 2008 at 4:33pm
Originally posted by hamayoun

Salam

Here is the profile of a self confessed 'paki basher'.  Don't view it if you are sensitive.  Would anyone not think that spreading a link like this around is exactly what the guy would want?  Wilders is in the same league as this guy.  If majority of dutch people support release of moive, it's because in Europe it's considerd free speech to spout racism.  Doesn't mean they agree with his sentiments.
That video is so set up...he barely makes contact with the 2 guys.  Trust me, i know the real thing, and that was all a set up.
Waiting an eternity for an apology from one who never apologizes but always demands one.
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Al-Cordoby  
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Rating: 0 of 0 votes Quote Al-Cordoby Replybullet Posted: 04 April 2008 at 5:14pm
The answer of questions raised by the film were given a few days ago on Islam On-Line:
 
Dr. Badawi's Answers to Questions on Wilder's Fitna

The best informed Muslim answers I've read so far by a western Muslim scholar:

http://www.islamonline.net/livedialogue/english/Browse.asp?hGuestID=pbEZYR

A must read for anyone interested in finding the right answers
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M.A.R.W.A.N
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Rating: 0 of 0 votes Quote M.A.R.W.A.N Replybullet Posted: 04 April 2008 at 5:15pm
I thought Wilder's hairdo looked like the kind of style Belle Watling (Rhett Butlerís favorite madam) would have come up with as a joke, except Wilder's took it seriously, kinda like his movie, and everyone else laughed, kinda like the public.

If I were a betting man, I'd bet what angers him most is the mild reaction to his film. And til now, this is what he is most famous for.....bad art.

I mean, when Irshad Manji is the one making fun of your work.....that's just embarassing!


Edited by M.A.R.W.A.N - 04 April 2008 at 5:27pm
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Urooj  
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Rating: 0 of 0 votes Quote Urooj Replybullet Posted: 04 April 2008 at 6:17pm
They're just spoilt little brats, who never got enough attention when they were kids, and their insecurities grew with them to the point where they'd do anything to get attention.

I feel sorry for them, more so when I think of what would happen to them in the Hereafter.. Definitely not worth wasting my time over.
Nisar main teri galiyon k, ay watan, k jahan
Chali hai rasm k koi na sar utha k chalay..!!
Hai ehl e dil k liye ab ye nazm e bast o kushad
K sang o khisht muqayyid hain aur sag azaad..!!
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