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InterReligious Dialogue
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Message Icon Topic: Conversion from Christianity to Islam: wh(Topic Closed Topic Closed) Post Reply Post New Topic
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algebra
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bullet Posted: 15 April 2008 at 6:14pm
Originally posted by Aviatrix

Actually what you're saying when you write "both beings would have the exact same understanding" is that both being are the exact same. Meaning there aren't two beings. Just ONE. Which was my point.




Whoa there....you are beginning to sound like a christian.

2 beings -1 mind, 1 purpose?

I stated 2 beings, now you are saying the two beings are really 1.

we seem to have arrived at christianity by using logic.


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Aviatrix  
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bullet Posted: 15 April 2008 at 6:19pm
LOL. No.
 
You stated two beings, but provided a situation which can only exist when there is ONE being.
 
So there must only be One.
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hamayoun  
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bullet Posted: 15 April 2008 at 6:19pm
Goodness me algebra, give it a break!  I hate to break this to you, but not too many people here want to hear about your very own 'man made version' of Islam.  Now can we please stay on topic?  Since you were NOT a Christian who came to Islam, I really think you should leave this thread for the intended audience.
May Allah give me patience, Ameen.

My blog: http://regularbaba.blogspot.com/
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struggle  
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bullet Posted: 15 April 2008 at 6:38pm
......
EYE FOR EYE
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hamayoun  
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bullet Posted: 15 April 2008 at 6:40pm
So start another thread.  STAY ON TOPIC please.
May Allah give me patience, Ameen.

My blog: http://regularbaba.blogspot.com/
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jamilahz  
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bullet Posted: 15 April 2008 at 7:07pm
Originally posted by hamayoun

Originally posted by jamilahz

I've shared my story here, is there anyone else that can give us a few lines about how they came to Islam and how it changed their lives.  It might help steer things away from the bitter negativity that this thread was not meant for. :)

Or, more precisely, what brought you from Christianity to Islam.  Would you have come without the reason and logic?


It had so much to do with reason and logic... it all made perfect sense.  I don't know the stats but there are so many scientist etc that come to Islam because of the scientific miracles in the Quran.
www.hudastore.com

www.theoneislam.com
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bullet Posted: 15 April 2008 at 8:12pm
Originally posted by Aviatrix

Think about if you had two presidents of the USA. One Democrat, and one Republican. What could ever get done!? We have two Democrats running against each other now and even they can't agree!!!
 
So more than one ruler doesn't make sense logically, there would be conflict--who would be superior? There has to be only One.
 
 Hi Amy.
 
 Taking a step aside from both our faiths for a sec. Whether God is one individual or three distinct individuals in one Godhead we are talking about the Divine. Man is man and imperfect in nature. God on the other hand is perfect in relation to all things . If God truly is 3 distinct individuals in one Godhead, then to suggest friction ( for want of a better word) between them is to suggest something less than divine, or weakness in one being in comparrison to the other, a corruptability if you like. Other than that i think its risky to dis-regard that which we dis-agree about God when reasoned by human logic. Strictly speaking God is not a logical concept. 
out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be the ruler in Israel: and his going forth is from the beginning, from the days of eternity. Micah 5:5
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bullet Posted: 15 April 2008 at 10:07pm
Originally posted by Aviatrix

LOL. No.
 
You stated two beings, but provided a situation which can only exist when there is ONE being.
 
So there must only be One.


why??? why??? what precludes two beings existing?

give me proof of why my situation is an impossibility.
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bullet Posted: 15 April 2008 at 10:16pm
Hamayoun,

If you want to tout the logic of islam, it is important to show readers both sides

I question the much vaunted 'logic' of islam,

IMHO if a person has come to islam, it is because they have lacked the logical insight to question its position.

A truly logical human being would reject the basic tenet of islam - tawheed.
tawheed - illogically defines boundaries on the nature of G_D.
Something I have always had a huge problem with.

Mind you, i dont object to monotheism - simply islamic monotheism.

I have logically shown you that christian monotheism is as valid if not more valid than islamic monotheism.

In effect, if logic is the reason why you leave christianity for islam - you have left christianity for the WRONG reason.
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bullet Posted: 15 April 2008 at 10:49pm
Simplicity of its theology should be the reason why people leave christianity to come to islam.
 
Oh! And also rationality. Muslims are not ask to give credence to such as the irrational concept of a triune divinity. 
 
Wait. There's another. Equality. The universality of Islam's brotherhood is appealing to westerners. In Islam, everybody is equal. The janitor and the CEO stands side by side.
 
What abt practicality? Islam is a very practical religion as against christianity's abstractionist outlook towards life on this earth.
 
There's more.
In life, be like a traveller. Take only what you need
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bullet Posted: 16 April 2008 at 1:56am
Originally posted by Damo808

Hi Amy.
 
 Taking a step aside from both our faiths for a sec. Whether God is one individual or three distinct individuals in one Godhead we are talking about the Divine. Man is man and imperfect in nature. God on the other hand is perfect in relation to all things . If God truly is 3 distinct individuals in one Godhead, then to suggest friction ( for want of a better word) between them is to suggest something less than divine, or weakness in one being in comparrison to the other, a corruptability if you like. Other than that i think its risky to dis-regard that which we dis-agree about God when reasoned by human logic. Strictly speaking God is not a logical concept. 
 
It's not friction which suggest something less than divinity, it is saying that God exists as more than One individual. To say God is two or three or more distinct individuals is what suggests something less than divine. That is the weakness.
 
If God makes himself as "father" and "son" then that is an analogy to humanity. But is a father the same as the son? Do the father and the son always agree? Or does one have to bow and respect the other? Isn't one inferior to the other? Naturally. So there's no sense in using an analogy that is already flawed? Or isn't that an analogy already in use. So I'll use it too.
 
If there is One purpose, then there is Only One God. But if you split that up, there is friction. It's not because humans are flawed, but in fact the very analogy is flawed. The only logical conclusion is that God is One.
 
And it is logical, of course. It is the conclusion which most people will independently arrive at.
 
For who do they call on in their moment of absolute peril? "Oh God!" When someone is confronted with death--who do they call on? "Oh God!" Just God. Just One. The Only One who can help. This is natural, it is a natural inclination really, that people tend to. What is illogical is to distort the natural inclination, which your body and your soul tell you, and to make things up about God that aren't true.
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bullet Posted: 16 April 2008 at 7:24am
Amy,

Please explain to me why having two beings with One purpose is a weakness?

your original assertion was that the weakness would be friction, I have explained to you that there will be none since an essential understanding of G_Ds if you will is that they are omniscient.

Amy, if you are truthful and can follow the logic of my posts, you will accept that islam works for you, not because it is more logical, but because you feel like believing in islam.

You have not been able to show that islamic monotheism is logically superior to the monotheism we have been discussing.

In truth your acceptance of islam is instinctual and not logical.

Perhaps you converted to prove a point to someone? to rebel? i dont know.
Either way you should never claim you converted because islam is more logical- its not.
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bullet Posted: 16 April 2008 at 8:29am
Salam my brothers & sisters,
 
Remember that we all are created by the same Allah. He teaches us to love one another, even he or she is your enemy.
 
We all now still alive due to His Mercy & Love. And we all soon or later will go back to His place in heaven. In heaven He won't ask your skin color, nationality, status, education and religion. He will ask you what you have done in this world.
 
We cannot say we are the servant of Allah if we do not follow Him.
Allah teaches us Love, so do not hate others. Killing is still Killing no matter the reason is.
 
The true servant of Allah will be the light for the people, not a burden for the society. Action sounds louder than a thousand word. So act and thing as the real servant of Allah. 
 
No Killing but Loving
No Blaming but Forgiving
No selfish but serving
Who are we, thus we can say we are right and they are wrong?
Can we say all buddists go to hell and others go to heaven?
 
No matter your religions, 
No matter how bad you are,
No matter how rich you are,
We are all created by the same creator, ALLAH.
Allah is full of Love and Mercy, so do love and mercy to others.
 
Allahhu Akbar!   
 
   
Wassalam, Soeharto Baramuli
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bullet Posted: 16 April 2008 at 9:01am

a leader is what god wants. A follower doesn't know what he is doing and trips over God's planned. then what religion does matter if it works within a person to believe in order to answer for their creation. God is important to us all...

EYE FOR EYE
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