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InterReligious Dialogue
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Message Icon Topic: Research Topic: Early Unitarians vs. Trinitarians Post Reply Post New Topic
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Al-Cordoby  
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Rating: 0 of 0 votes Quote Al-Cordoby Replybullet Posted: 24 July 2017 at 4:51pm
Also remember Damo that none of God's Prophets before Jesus, peace be upon him, since the early days of Adam and Noah, till Abraham and Moses and all the Israelite prophets, never said that believers should believe in a trinity.

Did they?

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Rating: 0 of 0 votes Quote Seeking Replybullet Posted: 24 July 2017 at 7:21pm
Originally posted by Al-Cordoby

Where are they today?With persecution, intimidation, torture and murder, they eventually ceased to exist, Damo.Some remains of their beliefs were passed on to the following generations, who refused to accept the concept of the divinity of Jesus.



That must have been some persecution, torture and murder. There must have been wars, campaigns and battles that might be in history books that also mention things like The Reformation, the Inquisition, etc

You keep asking Damo808 for evidence, but offer not a shred of your own for some pretty serious claims. I am aware of some of what you are alleging; after all, Jews persecuted Christians, Christians persecuted Jews, pagans persecuted Christians, then Christians persecuted pagans, then Christians turned on other Christians, and on and on and on. Islam also got into the act during its early years.
All of it is what turns so many people off from religion. But, near as I can tell, this level of persecution you are implying just isn't substantiated.


Edited by Seeking - 24 July 2017 at 10:48pm
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Damo808  
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Rating: 0 of 0 votes Quote Damo808 Replybullet Posted: 24 July 2017 at 8:07pm
Originally posted by Al-Cordoby

Also remember Damo that none of God's†Prophets before Jesus, peace be upon him, since the early days of Adam and Noah, till Abraham and Moses and all the Israelite prophets, never said that believers should believe in a trinity.Did they?


That is neither here nor there to the point of your OP. Infact from the start of this thread i've been trying to stick to the 1st 3 centuries of Christianity because that is what the OP demanded we discuss and your having none of it. As Seeking has said. You make accusation after accusation and offer nothing but pure suggestion for it to have happened not to mention so far a creible explanation as how it was all possible. People are just expected to accept everything at face value AL.

Edited by Damo808 - 24 July 2017 at 8:11pm
out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be the ruler in Israel: and his going forth is from the beginning, from the days of eternity. Micah 5:5
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Al-Cordoby  
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Rating: 0 of 0 votes Quote Al-Cordoby Replybullet Posted: 25 July 2017 at 3:49am
There are no Trinitarian Jews, Damo

That fact in itself means that the teachings Paul spread later on after Jesus contradicted with Jewish beliefs and teachings

Early Christians did NOT Believe in the Trinity - Bart Ehrman

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=le2YT76i8zY

(1 minute)

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Damo808  
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Rating: 0 of 0 votes Quote Damo808 Replybullet Posted: 25 July 2017 at 8:51am
Originally posted by Al-Cordoby


There are no Trinitarian Jews, Damo


Well if you were honest the first Christians were in fact Jews who did not reject Jesus as the Messiah. The onus remains with you to prove they were not Trinitarians.

Originally posted by Al-Cordoby

That fact in itself means that the teachings Paul spread later on after Jesus contradicted with Jewish beliefs and teachings


You still must prove how that happened until you do its nothing but a very weak allegation.

Originally posted by Al-Cordoby


Early Christians did NOT Believe in the Trinity - Bart Ehrman

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=le2YT76i8zY

(1 minute)


Are you sure about that ? How old is this lecture as his views have changed. He also believes the Crucifixion of Jesus to be a genuine historical event. Do you accept that view also ?
out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be the ruler in Israel: and his going forth is from the beginning, from the days of eternity. Micah 5:5
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Rating: 0 of 0 votes Quote Al-Cordoby Replybullet Posted: 25 July 2017 at 10:03am
Jews before Jesus, peace be upon him

Were they trinitarians?

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Rating: 0 of 0 votes Quote Corinna Replybullet Posted: 25 July 2017 at 1:32pm
Originally posted by Damo808


Well if you were honest the first Christians were in fact Jews who did not reject Jesus as the Messiah. The onus remains with you to prove they were not Trinitarians.
 


Damo, if, in fact, the "first Christians" were Jews they weren't Jewish after they began to believe a story like those about Jesus being the son of G-d and all the magical type things attributed to him.  The very basics of Judaism attest to that and have/were not changed.  

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Rating: 0 of 0 votes Quote Damo808 Replybullet Posted: 25 July 2017 at 1:46pm
Originally posted by Corinna


Originally posted by Damo808

Well if you were honest the first Christians were in fact Jews who did not reject Jesus as the Messiah. The onus remains with you to prove they were not Trinitarians.

Damo, if, in fact, the "first Christians" were Jews they weren't Jewish after they began to believe a story like those about Jesus being the son of G-d and all the magical type things attributed to him.† The very basics of Judaism attest to that and have/were not changed. †


Hi Corrina. Yours is a perspective, like mines like ALs like Waheed's.

out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be the ruler in Israel: and his going forth is from the beginning, from the days of eternity. Micah 5:5
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Rating: 0 of 0 votes Quote Corinna Replybullet Posted: 25 July 2017 at 8:59pm
Originally posted by Damo808

Originally posted by Corinna


Originally posted by Damo808

Well if you were honest the first Christians were in fact Jews who did not reject Jesus as the Messiah. The onus remains with you to prove they were not Trinitarians.
 

Damo, if, in fact, the "first Christians" were Jews they weren't Jewish after they began to believe a story like those about Jesus being the son of G-d and all the magical type things attributed to him.  The very basics of Judaism attest to that and have/were not changed.  


Hi Corrina. Yours is a perspective, like mines like ALs like Waheed's.



What I said is based on knowing the basics of Judaism.  A person cannot be both Christian and Jewish and that is a fact. 

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Rating: 0 of 0 votes Quote Damo808 Replybullet Posted: 25 July 2017 at 10:11pm


edit


Edited by Damo808 - 25 July 2017 at 10:12pm
out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be the ruler in Israel: and his going forth is from the beginning, from the days of eternity. Micah 5:5
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Rating: 0 of 0 votes Quote Damo808 Replybullet Posted: 25 July 2017 at 10:12pm
Originally posted by Corinna


What I said is based on knowing the basics of Judaism.† A person cannot be both Christian and Jewish and that is a fact.†


Who's claiming otherwise ? But didn't the destruction of the Temple signify all was not well within Judaism ? What legitimate Jewish priestly authority resides today annointed by the Lord ?
out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be the ruler in Israel: and his going forth is from the beginning, from the days of eternity. Micah 5:5
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Rating: 0 of 0 votes Quote Magister Replybullet Posted: 25 July 2017 at 10:12pm
Originally posted by Al-Cordoby

There are no Trinitarian Jews, Damo

That fact in itself means that the teachings Paul spread later on after Jesus contradicted with Jewish beliefs and teachings

Early Christians did NOT Believe in the Trinity - Bart Ehrman

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=le2YT76i8zY

(1 minute)





Amazing how secular scholars are confirming what the Quran said - subhanallah. If the Quran were not from God, then it would've been under the assumption that Christians always believed this.



Therefore anyone who sets aside one of the least of these commands and teaches others accordingly will be called least in the kingdom of heaven
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Rating: 0 of 0 votes Quote Damo808 Replybullet Posted: 25 July 2017 at 10:18pm
Originally posted by Magister


Originally posted by Al-Cordoby

<font size="3" face="Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif">There are no Trinitarian Jews, Damo<span id="eow-title" ="watch-title"="" dir="ltr" title="Early Christians did NOT Believe in the Trinity - Bart Ehrman"><font size="3" face="Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif">That fact in itself means that the teachings Paul spread later on after Jesus contradicted with Jewish beliefs and teachingsEarly Christians did NOT Believe in the Trinity - Bart Ehrmanhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=le2YT76i8zY(1 minute)</span>
Amazing how secular scholars are confirming what the Quran said - subhanallah. If the Quran were not from God, then it would've been under the assumption that Christians always believed this.


Really ??!! Where does the Quran confirm the Crucifixion of Jesus did occur as Ehrman believes ?

Pick and mix.
out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be the ruler in Israel: and his going forth is from the beginning, from the days of eternity. Micah 5:5
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Rating: 0 of 0 votes Quote Seeking Replybullet Posted: 26 July 2017 at 3:16am
Originally posted by Magister


Amazing how secular scholars are confirming what the Quran said - subhanallah. If the Quran were not from God, then it would've been under the assumption that Christians always believed this.


"To Muslims the Koran is the very word of God, who spoke through the Angel Gabriel to Muhammad: ''This book is not to be doubted,'' the Koran declares unequivocally at its beginning. Scholars and writers in Islamic countries who have ignored that warning have sometimes found themselves the target of death threats and violence, sending a chill through universities around the world."
http://www.nytimes.com/2002/03/02/arts/scholars-are-quietly-offering-new-theories-of-the-koran.html


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism_of_the_Quran

"Bart   January 21, 2016
I donít believe Iíve ever made an argument against Christianity, properly understood!"

https://ehrmanblog.org/am-i-converting-to-islam/








Edited by Seeking - 26 July 2017 at 11:20am
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